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Poll Poll

CS2D In ESL?

Only registered users are allowed to vote
Yes, would be great.
84.40% (92)
No.
10.09% (11)
I'm not sure.
5.50% (6)
109 votes cast

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

CoSmo
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People that only care to start a contrast with magik or care about "who closes the topic" ~~~> outrage box [ ].


Seriously stick to the ideas and the topic theme. Discuss like mature people.

This thread started well, we are just talking about how we can make this game better, and attract more players.


*To topic, i personally dont have much faith for ESL now that i think seriously about it, because CS2D isnt "ready" to withstand a pace like that.

I totally agree with the guys that said that we need to find a link between "for fun scene" and "competitive scene". There are several hundreds of players [for each continent] that actually are there, play a lot, but just prefer to spend their time in alternative game modes.


Imo, first let's try to get a good competitive CS2D, and then make the "big step". What do you think?

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

Yates
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@user CoSmo: CS2D needs an organised tournament "creator." - Not some random one that suddenly decides to create a tournament that appears 2 weeks before it happens with a random date no one can play on.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

CoSmo
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This is what we tried to do, with PCS Project in primis, and with IML at moment. Well, we do what we can, organizers, admins & stuff are all community users and players [like myself].


Personally i think that US.de isnt appropriate to do it, not because it cant, but because the forum itself so far has focused on other things. Surely would be more "official" to see a tourney powered by US.de, but so far i havent seen any try to know by myself that it can happen.


If there are more players, and more dedicated people that can actually help for real in extra-unrealsoftware organizations, standards are sure to rise.


What we had noticed lately [especially in European scene] is the more and more lack of players that play [or try to ] competitively. Especially the clans, have been less and less [even the some traditional ones closed one after the other !] in these years. I can find the reason that "old school" players lose their interest, because there arent any further motivations to continue playing [not a stimulating variety of tournaments], while newcomers tend to approach - as we said - the "fun" part of CS2D only.


To talk about myself, the motivation for me to grow ingame and become a good player was by seeing sH clan. Truly it was smthg like, an ideal for me. Aiming to join it one day was always in my mind at beginning.

This is only an example, but it shows that with right stimuli, all those players that lose time for nothing in fun servers can get the same interests. All we have to do is to bring more "advertising" from tournaments and clans to this part of CS2D scene.


What i am requesting is, somehow, to add News for instance, in unrealsoftware forums, about running tournaments, cups and competitions, as well as general scene news [for example europe's division whereabouts].


I will show you a link of how we [PCS] try to bring interest with news: http://www.pcs-project.eu/index.php?site=news_comments&newsID=173

Just simply, inform users of what's going on, it will motivate them surely to "be like them one day".


Maybe user DC: could try this. Of course not him only, the moderators could actually "copy" what's up from the other communities and make appropriate news.


This can be a step forward i think. Worth trying.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

fragezeichen
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that'd be probably a good approach.

but the competitive scene itself has to change too.

8on8 no fog de_dust/de_dust2 just won't attract any new players.

maybe there should be more focus on the 'mixmatches' (where 10 players get mixed together to form two teams to play a relaxed 5on5 match)
because ironically a lot of players in on these de_dust/de_dust2 servers would prefer to play these mixmatches instead of 'public gaming'.
and even more ironically all these mixmatch servers have the same password: match, but of course again only the involved competitive players know that. a new users will most likely not figure that out quickly.

and i think there's some pretty decent lua scripts, that allow non-admins to vote for maps, vote for restarts etc so that a mixmatch can be organized without the rcon password.

so why not host some public mixmatch servers with a good lua mod? (often admins are active enough to help out a lot too)

but it's really stupid to host mixmatch servers with a password that every involved competitive player knows, but only the new players don't know it.
(pretty good way to exclude new players...)

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

cortz
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There are rarely any matches in dust/dust2 anymore.

maps are usually dependent on the amount of players playing.
2v2 Would play in a small map like desert. 3v3 would play in desert, bridge, Lennox. 4v4 and 5v5 would play nuke, train, inferno, infernopod, tuscanpod, arno, Aztec, cbble..etc

I have never played a non fow dust/dust2 match. Hell I don't even remember the last time I played on those maps at all. I have also never seen an 8v8 match. Especially in dust/dust2. Whichever server you were playing on, they don't know what theyre doing.

The password, I believe, is to prevent random people from interrupting the game. And to prevent ghosting etc..

The password is intended for stupid people. Not nessesarily New people.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

deletion
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Maybe serverlist needs organizing because there are too many servers to choose from and only a few are actually playable ;l

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

palomino
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user deletion has written
Maybe serverlist needs organizing because there are too many servers to choose from and only a few are actually playable ;l

What is that supposed to mean?..

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

fragezeichen
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@cortz:
with de_dust/2 8on8 no fog, i mean the 16 slot public servers. those were the pcs-project public servers (before sh etc), some of the most active public servers which offer standard/competitive maps.

also ghosting is (usually) not a problem in mixmatch servers, because they're not clanwars, the teams are mixed (with mixed clans). so it's not about winning or any result, it's only about fun and about playing with match-settings.

the password was originally intended to be for private clan servers. but these are mostly being used for mixmatches.
it has become a 'tradition' to keep the password 'match' out of convenience, but when looking at it with a broader perspective, it's actually pretty stupid...

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

Yates
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user palomino has written
What is that supposed to mean?..

That the laggy crappy servers which try to be competitive disappear and leave the ones that are actually good for in the place.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

CoSmo
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user fragezeichen: The problem is, we tried to have some servers with good maps [like de_nuke, inferno, custom maps made for example by united etc] but were eventually closed due to zero [!] activity and popularity. The newbies wont try to play on difficult to understand maps, that's why there are some newcomers actually playing in PCS public servers [dust and dust2] everyday.

Simple maps for every newcomer is the best choice, everyone did the exact same at beginning. Unfortunately lately these "simple maps" tend to be citylife, zombie, and other fun modes.

I dont agree with mixes, because it cant be helped, since most of times they are organized by good players, they wont want less good players. Also, in PCS mix servers at least, there isnt rcon, but dedicated admins got script rights there. And since we have seen that not all people follow the rules, the number of server rights given is restricted. Having a "voting system" script isnt a bad idea btw.

For password of mixes, user cortz: gave the reason. At max we can write more infos about these servers passwords in PCS sites.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

palomino
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user Yates has written
user palomino has written
What is that supposed to mean?..

That the laggy crappy servers which try to be competitive disappear and leave the ones that are actually good for in the place.

For a second I thought he meant that he wanted to remove all the servers except competitive ones.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

zeeenk OP
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Yo guys,

Laxor asked me for SMTH.

He wanted to make smth like a "ESL.squad |" and take Video's from players with these Tags as another video for ESL. (A BIG BIG MOVIE)

I'm not sure about it, what do you think?

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

fragezeichen
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user CoSmo has written
most of times they [mixmatches] are organized by good players, they wont want less good players.

which is a perfect example of the problem.
the competitive community has this property of isolating themselves.
and now they're realizing that it's not quite working out...

the problem of people just joining a running mixmatch should not be solved with a password, because it again has the side effect of isolation.
instead it can (and should) be easily fixed with lua scripts.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

krabob
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It makes no sense judging 'new players' that don't get into the competitive scene, when most competitive players dislike new players and do not let/want them play in matches and mixes.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

CoSmo
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That's a prob that cant be solved easily. Good players dont want to play with newbies. That's a fact.

Lua scripts can be an idea, like lock teams for example.

Hmm will discuss this in PCS.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

cortz
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user CoSmo has written
That's a prob that cant be solved easily. Good players dont want to play with newbies. That's a fact.

Lua scripts can be an idea, like lock teams for example.

Hmm will discuss this in PCS.


pcs doesn't control the competitive scene, nor is it the only source of servers to play on.

Your perspective is too narrow.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

FlooD
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user cortz has written
user CoSmo has written
That's a prob that cant be solved easily. Good players dont want to play with newbies. That's a fact.

Lua scripts can be an idea, like lock teams for example.

Hmm will discuss this in PCS.


pcs doesn't control the competitive scene, nor is it the only source of servers to play on.

Your perspective is too narrow.

we all know that pcs is just one community.

i'm pretty sure he just meant that maybe we should also bring this discussion to pcs since the pcs community has many competitive players.

@user fragezeichen: ,@user CoSmo:
for an lua system for mixteams, i think the easiest way is to set a player as the admin (who can restart, makespec, lock teams, etc...). for example, make the first person who joins the server the admin. if more people join, and everyone wants a different admin, they can vote for a new admin. does this seem reasonable??

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

krabob
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user fragezeichen has written
maybe it would help the situation if they could see the competitive community here already.
not by links to other pages, but with several boards:
- clan/member search
- clan forum (for introduction and talking aobut clans)
- tournament forum (where tournaments get announced on this official forum


Guessing by this thread cs2d IMLeague CS2D being closed and the rule not to advertise stuff, your suggestions won't be done.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

robed
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i could give a mass advertising in youtube and random spams in other site about cs2d if you want me to.

old Re: CS2D in ESL?

fragezeichen
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@user FlooD:
i think figuring out the best way to implement something like this is quite hard. but if these servers are being used actively admins/mods should be there often too (which would be optimal, because no script will be as good as a mature human as admin)

@user krabob:
well, this topic is also about suggesting changes. and that can also mean changing already existing habits.

maybe it'd be a good time for user DC to give a statement what he thinks of the suggestions in this thread so far and what his opinion is on supporting the competitive scene.

(i think it'd be a pity if cs2d only consisted of construction/zombie/superhero/etc fun modes...)
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