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old Re: Massive Mod

Psytechnic
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That's really bad forum etiquette Volshebnyi... A modification, patch or derivative work of a mod is in itself its own separate entity.

1: You should have asked builder whether you could release this.
2: You gave no notice or warning that you were planning this, so no one had the chance to tell you to ask builder or if it was even wanted/needed.
3: Many of your 'fixes' may have already been implemented for the next release of MM, so your patch may actually be redundant.
4: MM is still an ongoing project, so although this patch might work now, it might not on the next release.

Forum etiquette, although respected and sometimes enforced, is still not binding legality, but copying someone's work, title and injecting it into their mod thread might raise some issues.

If you ever create your work from someone elses, you MUST get their permission unless they have licensed the material in such a way that it is free from permissions.

All modifications of the Stranded II game are derivative works and are therefore subject to the license which Stranded II is released under. This means all mods carry the same license as the game or a comparable one, and being that builder hasn't applied a license, then this mod has the same 'attribution' stipulation as the game.

In layman's terms, this means you should:

1: out of respect, ask builder if you can do this with his work.
2: clearly state in some place in the 'fix' that this is a derivative work of Stranded II by DC on a modification known as Massive Mod created by Builder2-0.

old Re: Massive Mod

Volshebnyi
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Psytechnic,
1) Sorry.
2) About notice or warning. I made it for 3 hours, and I didn't know, that I can't just make patch for someone's mod and post it here.
3) That's the point. Builder can include this patch to the next release. This is unofficial patch.
4) This is a patch for current release only.
5) It's not a copying of someone's work. This patch contains only edited files and doesn't work at all without original MM.

So, Builder, can I post link again? This patch is unofficial, so I don't see any problem.

old Re: Massive Mod

charzy
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I'm afraid that almost all of those are IN the latest release!

It is common manners to ask someone before using their work to make your own. *directs the finger of shame towards Valshebnyi*

old Re: Massive Mod

Volshebnyi
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charzy, It's a patch for the latest MM release + Fishing Mod. These fixes may appear only in next version, but I can't find TODO list or something like this.

>>It is common manners to ask someone before using their work to make your own.
Again: I'm not using someone's work, it's not a new mod, it's a patch for already existing mod. It includes only changed scripts.
I think that it will be better to improve one big mod together than make many small mods. Since this patch is unofficial, Builder can use it or not in the next release. Consider it like usual patch for opensource product.

old Re: Massive Mod

charzy
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Builder, would you mind me creating salted meats (I need something to do with that salt!), bacon (cut meat) and a few other meals for your mod? perhaps adding herbs to make meals could provide benifits like health restore or maybe making you sleepy (I hate it when I can't get him to sleep)?

I have basic modding experience but I want to ask you if you mind BEFORE I make it, thanks.
edited 1×, last 04.11.10 07:31:37 pm

old Re: Massive Mod

Psytechnic
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In the same sentence, you contradicted your own words. Not once, but twice...

Volshebnyi has written
Response to me:
5) It's not a copying of someone's work. This patch contains only edited files...


Yeah, that's an edited copy, or a "derivative work of"...

Volshebnyi has written
Response to charzy:
... I'm not using someone's work ... it's a patch for already existing mod ... It includes only changed scripts ...


The point I was trying to make is that making a patch for a mod, using ANY PART OF IT (even modifying one single inf file) is still legally classified as a derivative work of the previous product. Being that MM is under the same license as S2 itself, then you need to add "attribution" and ask. This applies to software, pictures, text documents, patches and anything. Even with a piece of FOSS released under GNU GPL v3, as the author of my work, I still have many rights that prevent the use of my software in some ways.

However, I do agree with your idea of collaborative thinking, but then again, when was it ever fair to put all your hard work into a massive (excuse the pun) project just to have someone go "Oh, but you could have done this better" or "I made this for you, will you use it?". It seems like a genuine enough gesture, but you might actually cause more problems than good. People aren't sure which one of the mod makers are responsible for errors that arise and it could also cause internal conflict on the project if the modders' vision of the future of the project flow in different directions...

Nice of you to raise these issues for builder and a "Hell yeah!" for writing out the solutions, but putting anything out for download is classed as publishing and that's an entirely different kettle of legal fish.

old Re: Massive Mod

Builder2-0
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charzy has written
Builder, would you mind me creating salted meats (I need something to do with that salt!), bacon (cut meat) and a few other meals for your mod? perhaps adding herbs to make meals could provide benifits like health restore or maybe making you sleepy (I hate it when I can't get him to sleep)?

I have basic modding experience but I want to ask you if you mind BEFORE I make it, thanks.

See my reply to ab6100:
Builder2-0 has written
ab6100 has written
he has a point maps with lag suck!

@ builder
i'd like to volenter my work as a wepon maker
i'll make wepons with combos &scripts &Icons for MM then post them as a patch:) just tell me if its okay EDIT*this will give uses to the useless objects in MM such as bone and bamboo

If you do that, make your own inf files. eg;

abs_combinations.inf
abs_weapons.inf

That way if I decide to include them I don't have to mess around with merging my files with yours.


In other news, I've been incredibly busy with work. I'll probably have a short break this weekend and I'll try to get out a new version.

old Re: Massive Mod

charzy
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Well, here's salted big meat and it's combination!

5 salt and one large meat to make one large salted meat, it it fast to make and won't give you food poisoning! It fills you up but also makes you a bit thirsty (well, it's full of salt!)
*snip*

http://www.mediafire.com/?arvfrfbmz1idj

New files here, it has small salted meat as well, it gives as much food as a fried meat, won't give you food poisoning and gives you half the thirst of the big salted meat.
edited 1×, last 07.11.10 12:33:19 pm

old Re: Massive Mod

sny420
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Found a minor bug with the grill and forge...

If the water detail level is above medium it becomes impossible to put items on top of the grill/forge. Instead, they either appear underneath and then drop, or they just fly off and land beside. The items will still cook, it just doesn't look right...

I turned all the graphics down and the grill worked just fine. Then I turned just the water detail up, to the lowest setting that has reflection, and the bug recurred. Finally, I set all graphics to max, except water, and the grill worked fine again. I've tried a number of other combinations, and every time I get the same result; raising the water detail level above medium breaks the grill/forge. (Luckily, the waves are tied to effects detail rather than water!)

This bug occurred on both Vista and 7 (both are ultimate 64 versions), and on both executables. (win_7 and standard) I have no idea why water reflection would cause problems with the grill and forge, but I'm 100% sure that's what's happening.

To end this on a more positive note, I haven't found any other bugs besides a few missing or unused items. (mollusks, cooking pot, etc.) Well, ok, the lava forge doesn't work but that's been mentioned. Overall it's a tremendous mod that has renewed my love for the game. Keep up the great work, I would love to see this 100% finished some day!

old Progress

Lizard Ant
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This thread has been pretty quiet lately, so thought id break the silence

Just Wondering if Stranger has made any progress on the map, i know it could take like up to a year, but jsut wondering if its started or anything

old MM Patch

Builder2-0
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Long overdue patch:
http://www.filedropper.com/mmpatch5_1

Note: This is basically the same update I had finished a few weeks ago; all I've done is commented out a few blatantly unfinished features (ie: shields\blocking\clothing). It *should* work fine, but if you notice anything odd (eg: the game breaking, or random messages spewing out variables at you during gameplay) just point it out as usual.

Patch Changes has written
-Fixed steel barrels
-Fixed mine taking items
-Fixed map marker bug.
-Added iron\steel hooks
-Increased chance of sheep breeding
-Buffed bandages
-Nerfed\buffed first aid kits

old Re: Massive Mod

charzy
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You should add hard steel barrels to the pickup script BTW.

old Re: Massive Mod

Sumpfkraut
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Psytechnic has written
Nice of you to raise these issues for builder and a "Hell yeah!" for writing out the solutions, but putting anything out for download is classed as publishing and that's an entirely different kettle of legal fish.

Yes, but some issues are only problems once they are problematised.

There is de facto no harm done. It's therefore a non-issue, and everything further is bureaucratic technicalities which help no one.

And besides, in the TW modding community for example submods are welcome with open arms. No one takes any issue whatsoever with modified files, and it's working just splendid so far.

Just a tip to maybe take things lightly.


Though I guess him just releasing it as a patch is kind of awkward.
edited 1×, last 20.11.10 12:32:40 am

old Re: Massive Mod

Psytechnic
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Sumpfkraut has written
Psytechnic has written
Nice of you to raise these issues for builder and a "Hell yeah!" for writing out the solutions, but putting anything out for download is classed as publishing and that's an entirely different kettle of legal fish.

Yes, but some issues are only problems once they are problematised.


So with this sentence, you're telling me that problems are only problems when someone points something out as a problem when it's not really a problem... Nice and confusing, but I think I understand your sentiment.

However, copyright legality isn't something that can be problematised as it is already a problem. I'm not making it out to be one, it's a fact, legality can really screw with freedom of ideas. I'm all for freedom, but to get an idea out, you have to traverse through legal banter.

Sumpfkraut has written
There is de facto (This is not a good alternate for "by default" in this situation) no harm done. It's therefore a non-issue (are you trying to play laguage here?), and everything further is bureaucratic technicalities (I'll take that as a yes ;p) which help no one.

And besides, in the TW modding community for example submods are welcome with open arms. No one takes any issue whatsoever with modified files, and it's working just splendid so far.


I agree that beurocracies help no one, but that's because they affect people so strongly. Dismissing them will only lead to you getting caught by them and suffering from it. I don't know about the licensing schematic of TW but I have read into the Stranded license as it cause a tiny bit of controvesy over the switch to Creative Commons but this does protect DCs work better and it specifies "attribution" must be given, this applies to mods and patches for mods too.

Sumpfkraut has written
Just a tip to maybe take things lightly.


You seem to misinterpret my intentions here. If you feel in anyway offended by what I've said, I apologise, but I am purely looking out for your interests. I saw that this patch was a good idea, but the release of it was unwarranted and cause a few posters to shoot off at you. I just wanted to point out how this all played out in a legal sence. I'm actually trying to help you...

Sumpfkraut has written
Though I guess him just releasing it as a patch is kind of awkward.


I'm sure for him, it was nice to have other people help find faults and provide solutions, but trying to have it as a seperate download could cause some confusion for players as not everyone reads the words around "Download here!"...

Your work (IMO) is appreciated, it's all about delivery.

This does however make a massive distraction to the question I wanted to ask...

"Builder, how far would you say you were in creating a final version? Youve done so much, it must be up to like 99.999% or something by now. ;)"

old window mode

trikerchick
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Sorry if this has been asked elsewhere but is there a way to play the massive mod bat windowed like the StrandedII -win.bat?


EDIT: Nevermind I figured it out LOL
edited 1×, last 27.11.10 07:13:13 pm

old Re: Massive Mod

whaaa
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Hey guys I can't seem to figure out the distiller. What exactly does it do and how does it work?

old Re: Massive Mod

UnIdEnTiFiEd
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the distiller boils salt water into normal water and gives you salt. you will of course, need a fire place underneath it.

old Re: Massive Mod

charzy
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UnIdEnTiFiEd has written
the distiller boils salt water into normal water and gives you salt. you will of course, need a fire place underneath it.


It also takes goddamn FOREVER.

old Re: Massive Mod

whaaa
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Thanks I thought so but how do you get the salt water into it?

old Re: Massive Mod

charzy
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whaaa has written
Thanks I thought so but how do you get the salt water into it?


Get some empty bottles, go up to water and press "e", but only for as many bottles as you are going to fill, or you will begin to drink it and become thirsty, then you add that to the distiller, light it up with lots of fuel and wait for an ingame week while the thing gives you 1 bottle of water and about 50 salt
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